Daimler To Replace CATIA With NX

Yesterday Siemens PLM announced that starting in the summer of 2012, Daimler AG would be using NX as their new platform for worldwide car and truck development. According to the press release, the decision to move away from CATIA was mainly due to the need for tighter integration of their CAD system with Smaragd, their home grown PLM system based on TeamCenter from Siemens PLM.

To give you an idea of the size and complexity of Smaragd, consider this. It is a global PLM system running on 100 servers and has four integrated databases. It is used by 8,000 engineers spread across the world along with designers, staff at production facilities and even members of the executive board. Its support center is located in the Daimler plant in Sao Paulo, Brazil. Smaragd, which means emerald in German, has been deployed for use in hundreds of projects. It manages data for hundreds of thousands of components, tools and 3D models. The design data itself is more than 30 terrabytes. Although the support for Smaragd is offered from Brazil the servers and databases are located in Kosice in Slovakia. So if Daimler needed to standardize on a single supplier, common sense dictates that they would be better off keeping their existing PLM system and switching their CAD system.

Today Dassault Systemes issued a terse press release stating their displeasure with Daimler’s decision to dump CATIA for NX. The press release said, “V6 openness to other PDM systems is part of PLM V6 R2011x, which was announced yesterday“. In the press release, Dassault Systemes almost denigrated Smaragd by calling it a “home grown PDM system”, which clearly it is not. If Dassault Systemes really believes that Smaragd is merely a PDM system, then it may explain why they cannot understand why Daimler wants to stick with it.

Dassault Systemes also noted in their press release that Daimler had not performed an evaluation of CATIA V6. The thing with CATIA V6 is that if you really want to make full use of its collaborative environment it needs to use ENOVIA V6 as its PLM backbone. I guess mere “openess to other PDM systems” will not do. Otherwise you will end up with a PLM system that is basically a big patchwork and has the potential of creating more problems than it solves.

A couple of months ago Daimler renewed its CATIA contract with Dassault Systemes for 5 years. So obviously this announcement came as a blow to them. Daimler has also kept Dassault Systemes in the dark as to whether they will continue to use the ENOVIA, DELMIA, SIMULIA and 3DVIA solutions that have currently implemented.

  • Neil

    I presume this means a move away from Solidworks to Solidedge as well??? Do they have SW seats in the mix or is it all Catia?…perhaps not if there is no SW-Catia translator available. Still thats quite a significant decision and a decent amount of $$. Obviously not taken lightly. There must be a little more to that story though surely. Perhaps they tried out the search engine for DaimlerAG and got Tata Motors as the first result. ;)

  • http://www.facebook.com/cacciatorino Alessandro Marchetti

    There must be something more that was not said. I guess that DS was ready to extend the support to V5 for at least 20 years more, if only Daimler asked for it. V6 is not a dogma to be accepted as is, and I think DS was ready to do everything to avoid to loose this important customer. From the Daimler side, if they moved to another CAD (it means: CAE, CAM, training and everything else), they must have a really strong reason to face with a so heavy migration.

  • http://www.facebook.com/cacciatorino Alessandro Marchetti

    There must be something more that was not said. I guess that DS was ready to extend the support to V5 for at least 20 years more, if only Daimler asked for it. V6 is not a dogma to be accepted as is, and I think DS was ready to do everything to avoid to loose this important customer. From the Daimler side, if they moved to another CAD (it means: CAE, CAM, training and everything else), they must have a really strong reason to face with a so heavy migration.

  • http://www.deelip.com Deelip Menezes

    It seems they have 5 years to do the migration, which should be enough. But, you are right. I’m pretty sure there is a lot more to this than just those two press releases.

  • d3print

    I know this sounds weard, but both`s Daimler and Siemens headquarter based in Germany , could it be one reason? Some company policy issue perhaps? Who knows.

  • http://www.deelip.com Deelip Menezes

    Indeed. It does sound weird. Very weird. ;-)

  • http://www.deelip.com Deelip Menezes

    The Dassault Systemes statement did not mention SolidWorks. The number of engineers using their PLM system is 8,000. I am not sure how many of them have CATIA licenses. But I’m assuming the number is a large one.

  • d3print

    Ok :), here`s article from Catia community.
    http://www.catiacommunity.com/print_article.php?cpfeatureid=55238

  • http://www.deelip.com Deelip Menezes

    Looks like Siemens PLM failed to mention to CPDA that Daimler did not even evaluate CATIA V6

  • http://twitter.com/mflayler mflayler

    The top three here in the US switched to NX already, I actually expected this and I don’t think it will stop with Daimler.

  • Kiran Kumar

    They might have done it. Catia V6 is very different from earlier versions. From what i heard PLM is inherent and there is no file for the CAD Model (though it can be if need but not by default) which forces customers to be tightly coupled to their product for life for both CAD and PLM, making migration very difficult later and may CAD designer cant digest the concept of CAD Model with out a file.

  • http://www.facebook.com/cacciatorino Alessandro Marchetti

    CoCreate is german too, but it is not used. :-)

    Really, may be that the main reason for this change was that at the moment to decide if to change the PDM to stay on Catia, they preferred to change the CAD to hold on TeamCenter.

  • http://www.deelip.com Deelip Menezes

    “They might have done it.”

    No. The Dassault Systemes statement said that they didn’t.

  • Kiran Kumar

    If I were DS, I wouldnt confess… for customer trying my product and not opting for it. ;)… anyway lets believe in DS for now.

  • uwegraphics

    DB is doing their long term data backup in step, – maybe that a reason, how can you rework existing designs in step in V5 /v6 do they have any tools – or will they still explode down to surface models? No ST

  • chad

    It appears that Daimler AG made a poor decision in the beginning and now they’re struggling to find an answer to it. Since they picked the PLM over the CAD software you can tell that management is driving this decision. All the more reason for DS to switch it’s stradegy away from these big companies and start focusing on the medium/small sized ones.

  • Dave Ault

    I don’t expect it to stop here either. Manufacturing concerns want control of their proprietary data and clear direction of where critical software aps are headed. Dassault is promising cloud fluff and things that work on IPADS. meanwhile companies have big investments in manufacturing and don’t care for the idea that their desires are being bypassed for social media creations and clouds that are talked about but never in exacting details. And of course nothing even remotely as user friendly as ST as the French guys have said it is unimportant. Parasolids to ACIS as the geometry kernal and you know THAT is not going to go smoothly. Wiring harnesses times two again I suspect and I bet Diamler does not want to be there to find out.

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_FYKNKR7FUSI5CWWDEAMSJYLXFQ Murray Dickinson

    “Chuck Grindstaff, President and Chief Technology Officer, explained that Daimler conducted an extensive eighteen month evaluation of the Siemens PLM Software products, the Dassault Systèmes product stack, and a potential mix of the two.” Does that mean that DS didn’t give them any notice of V6?

  • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_FYKNKR7FUSI5CWWDEAMSJYLXFQ Murray Dickinson

    “Chuck Grindstaff, President and Chief Technology Officer, explained that Daimler conducted an extensive eighteen month evaluation of the Siemens PLM Software products, the Dassault Systèmes product stack, and a potential mix of the two.” Does that mean that DS didn’t give them any notice of V6?

  • Nainar

    May be they did not want to look at V6, for what ever reason. We may never know unless five years down the line you interview one of the executives who were part of this decision.

  • Nainar

    May be they did not want to look at V6, for what ever reason. We may never know unless five years down the line you interview one of the executives who were part of this decision.

  • Alex

    What’s less clear is the effect on CATIA and Enovia sales of the loss of IBM’s imprimatur. IBM account representatives had very high connections in the IT organizations of their customers. These connections opened doors for Dassault Systèmes in large accounts and discouraged large customers from defecting during the trying transitions from CATIA V3 to V4 and again from V4 to V5. Now Dassault Systèmes is attempting to pull customers through another transition from CATIA V5 to V6, but without IBM’s help.
    Meanwhile, arch-rival UGS has become Siemens PLM software. Siemens is a highly respected brand both in Europe and Asia. If CATIA customers find the V5-to-V6 transition too difficult or too costly, they may be more willing to jump to Siemens than they were when CATIA was under IBM’s wing.
    What happens to Dassault Systèmes’ sales surge after the IBM glow is gone?

  • Alex

    What’s less clear is the effect on CATIA and Enovia sales of the loss of IBM’s imprimatur. IBM account representatives had very high connections in the IT organizations of their customers. These connections opened doors for Dassault Systèmes in large accounts and discouraged large customers from defecting during the trying transitions from CATIA V3 to V4 and again from V4 to V5. Now Dassault Systèmes is attempting to pull customers through another transition from CATIA V5 to V6, but without IBM’s help.
    Meanwhile, arch-rival UGS has become Siemens PLM software. Siemens is a highly respected brand both in Europe and Asia. If CATIA customers find the V5-to-V6 transition too difficult or too costly, they may be more willing to jump to Siemens than they were when CATIA was under IBM’s wing.
    What happens to Dassault Systèmes’ sales surge after the IBM glow is gone?

  • Rick McWilliams

    I get the feeling that DS is headed in the direction of taking more control over customers design tools. This is the direction of less choice and less freedom for the users. Burying CAD data in an unscrutable monlithic database takes away some control. Moving the CAD application from the desktop to the cloud takes away control. One trippy little bug and the entire customer base of DS could be shut down. Our product data must be accessible and useable for 20 years. Even after the software vendor is gone.

    DS seems to have a limited view of PDM. Even my small products have a lot more engineering content than than of a set of Solidworks files. There is electronics, simuation, microcontroller software, development systems, circuit boards, vendor product specifications, advertising design, contracts, notes, calculations, piles of email, graphic design, renderings, fluid simulation, magnetic modeling, optical engineering, mold design, and weblinks. I like to use the most effective tools for each of these tasks. The best tools change in time and we move to those tools. I hate how MS office has evolved. The preferred platform may change and we will move.

    DS give me reliable geometry, less bugs and the freedom to complement a fine CAD product with other fine and specialized design tools.

  • Kevin Quigley

    When Siemens bought EDS they promised a new landscape in manufacturing unification – from CAD tools right through to the controllers on the machine tools and the automation systems that run the factories. This has not happened yet. For Siemens, the CAD side and the PLM side is a tiny fraction of their overall business. Factory automation, controllers and so on is more significant.

    There is also the locality issue. Siemens and Mercedes are about as German as a German company can get – it does matter, and we do not know what behind the scenes politics goes on.

    My own view is that it is more political than technical, and that, just possibly, Siemens have shown Mercedes a long term unified manufacturing strategy or technology that appealed. Who knows.

  • Octane Indigo

    Siemens bought EDS … ???
    I heard this is funded venture.
    Siemens have paid UGS to keep up R&D and they just changed the name..

  • Kevin Quigley

    Sorry, I meant UGS. HP own EDS now I think. EDS sold UGS to a private equity firm then Siemens bought it from them.

  • proepro

    When did Daimler transition from V4 to V5?

  • Kz75

    Does any one know the why Chrysler also switched DS VPM to UGS TeamCenter? Chrysler also gradually replace V5 with NX.
    Daimler and Chrysler were once under one roof called DaimlerChrysler?

  • Mudumby Sudarshan

    big time users of cad in future would backward integrate and have their own PLM solutions. what i personally feel is Ds has failed in seamlessly integrating catia and enovia providing the users of these solution’s a opportunity to fill in the void using their own IT intellect and R&D…

  • Kmeintjes

    Siemens will probably tell you they won the Chrysler deal in a fair contest. Others might say that the influence of Fiat was a factor.

  • http://www.labatterie.com labatterie

    Others might say that the influence of Fiat was a factor.

  • Andrew_roberts_ng

    Dear Kz75, Chrysler was forced to switch NX and Teamcenter
    because they are now owned by Fiat ! Fiat is a long time user of NX
    and Teamcenter !

  • Uwegraphics

    Question to V6 [Enovia] experts,
    is the a revision management? heard there is none in V6 …
    I cannot … can someone tell me if its true?

  • Pingback: Daimler 3Boyut Stratejisini Catia’dan NX’ e Çeviriyor | 3DCatia Blog Bölümü




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